The Camera Cafe Show
Jen: They are way more important than my camera gear. I would happily go out of them any day of the week without any devices. And I don't know how many people can say that, that they can tolerate human beings without technology now. But yeah, these guys are really next level and I say I can't thank them enough.
Dave: Spanning the globe to bring great photographers and their experiences directly to you. It's 08:00 p.m. In Japan, 01:00 p.m. In Spain, and high noon in our guests home in Folkstone, Kent in southeast England. That means it's time for the camera cafe show brought to you by photographers Tom Jacob and Dave Payne. Hello there, Tom, would you like to welcome our special guest and introduce her to our listeners?
Tom: Thanks, Dave, and welcome everyone with us. Today, an amazing, strong photographer, I can say in a way that she has a physical impairment which would be seen as making life harder as a photographer, but she went out and made it happen, and that alone is, just a fantastic story you want to hear, right, Dave?
Dave: Absolutely.
Tom: Today we talk with Jen Reid from the UK and we will walk together through her journey. How she unspired her disability, became a great nature art, and pet photographer, and hope she can inspire us all. So welcome to the show today, Jen.
Jen: Hi there, guys. Thank you for having me.
Dave: it's our pleasure. Our pleasure.
Dave: Jen, you mentioned in some of your descriptions that you are, quote, disabled but not unable, close quote. That really strikes close to home for me because I'm a fellow disabled photographer as well.
Dave: What you've achieved and what you're doing is really special. Can you tell us a little bit about how your disability hasn't stopped you and how you adapted your approach to photography to create your incredible images?
Jen: Well, first, I'm glad I could inspire you as well. We need to band together as a disabled community and, push out, obviously, to bigger, communities that we're still completely able to do everything else. I don't really know where to start with my m animal photography and my disability, though.
Jen: It's all the mindset, isn't it? If, you have a good mindset, good things will come. But of course, practice, practice, practice.
Dave: Tell us, Jen, tell us a little bit, just a little about your disability and then how you've adapted your approach. You've already got the great mindset. How did you adapt your approach to photography to get those images of yours?
Jen: Okay, so I have a disability called phocomelia which mainly affects my right, arm. It looks like a trex, arm for those trying to imagine it. But I call it my lucky fin. My main adaptions for my camera is one, finding the professional camera that has to be small enough to fit my only hand. And then secondly, I have a cable tie and some duct tape, which I use to get one of my fingers on my fin in so I can change my focal length because I can't grip the circular focus plane.
Jen: And then I also have an adapter which is basically a blue stick. And I line the subjects animals, plants. In my frame using the notches on said stick. So there's four. And if they're very small animals, like a kingfisher, then that would be on notch one. But if they're bigger like a lion or tiger, notch two. And that really helps me.
Tom: Wow, you got it all figured out, Jen, there your working process.
Jen: Yeah, it took me a while to figure it out and sometimes I still struggle finding the animal in the frame. Not all of them have the one, or two notch rules. Sometimes it can be four. Three or four.
Tom: Let's go a bit back now, Jen, how you decided to become a pet and wildlife photographer?
Jen: I had a situation arise with my dog and that made me start photography in general. And then a few years later, we had our, ah, lockdown here in the UK and I gave my pets photography child syndrome, which every time I pulled up my camera, they were like, please Mum, no, no more. So I went out and started photographing the wildlife instead. And now juggled both very happily.
Tom: Okay, and what's the situation that triggered it with your dog?
Jen: He nearly died. I won't get into it because trigger warning, of course, but yeah, it wasn't very pleasant. He thankfully is very much alive and he's healthy at six and a half years old now.
Tom: And you started making pictures of him from being afraid he would die and to have pictures of him?
Jen: Yeah. when he was in the vets. I had like a flash, basically like life before your eyes kind of flash. And I realized that although mobile phone selfies are, incredible for capturing the moment, but when you have a situation like this on your hands and you're trying to find a photo that really captures the true personality of what your pet is, I had nothing that really.
Jen: That spoke to me and that broke my heart. So my main goal in photography is to capture your pet's personality to the fullest. So you never have to go through what I went through.
Tom: It's amazing. Also, I remember you told us you will do free sessions for people who have animals in the last moments?
Jen: Yes, I do. Free end of life sessions for all animals, even your turtles and your fish, just to make sure that you do have that one photo and on an emotional level for you and people is a very touching subject.
Jen: I've had mixed opinions on why I do this. It, is very emotional on my behalf as much as owners. But that sadness and heartbreak does eventually turn into just pure magical love when they see the final result. I've had people wanting the photos within the week, and I've had other people that haven't wanted to see them for about a year. It all depends on, of course, where you stand in the emotional range. But I am there for you, however long it will take.
Dave: Jen, a question real quick, just so that our listeners are clear. You're doing wildlife photography and also people's pet photography, correct?
Jen: Yep. And I also do work in dogs as busy, busy.
Dave: Wow.
Tom: Dave, I think it's the right person to ask. Maybe. Jen, give me two or three tips how I can make the best pictures from my dogs. They never sit still.
Jen: Okay.
Jen: So first, I would say if they're food orientated, use their dinner. A simple sit and stay. You only need four to 5 seconds minimum to get their attention. So, yeah, if they're food orientated, use their food next to your camera, and as soon as they look over, there's your photo. If they're toy orientated, same thing, but you have to learn as well. The second tip I'd give you is when and when not to use food or toys because too much preys will bore them and get them uninterested and not enough will also do the same thing. And my second tip, my third tip. Sorry, would be eye level. If you can get eye level on any animal that brings an extra connection to the viewer of your photo, saying eye level is 100% must go to,but as a great starting point, always. Try to get eye level. And if you have a chihuahua, then unfortunately you're going to have to go on the ground.
Dave: What if your pet is a snake?
Jen: Oh. Snakes are very cool to photo.
Jen: I have a very strict rule with my business that I will not bring a snake out or any animal that involves a tank does not leave a tank. And like a snake that require a lot of heat, they do not come out of said heat source because it's very dangerous for them. Those snakes. Yeah. Ah, 50 50, you can get them on a good day.
Jen: But if you find someone especially that has, I'd say trained it. Trained a snake. Some snakes only come out because they only feed them. So every time there's food around, they can quite get quite snappy, if that's the right word to do it. So if you find someone that has a snake that is really good with being handled, you can get some fantastic shots just in their vivarium. I think that's the correct word for.
Tom: Well, this will be studio shots, but if you do with the dogs Jen, you do outdoor shoots or you do them in a makeshift studio?
Jen: I don't personally have my own studio. I make a makeshift one, either at their house or at my house with my own pets of course. But yes, I would very much prefer them to be outside living their best life, sniffing all the leaves.
Tom: These pictures I can make with mine. I have the problem with if I put them in a studio, they will just never. I can do them one by one, but all the three together is very difficult.
Jen: Yeah, I can imagine.
Tom: Jen, let's go a bit to your wildlife. You know, it gets obvious the more photographers Dave and I interview, they all walk from starting out in wildlife photography and they end up in nature conservation. Is that also the case for you, Jen? Are you active in it?
Jen: yes, I was active in it before I became a photographer anyway. But now I am a photographer and I have a deeper respect for individual species on this planet.
Jen: I am very much active in it. I'm in support of and donate to quite a few charities, the RSPB, the Royal Society of Birds in the UK. I'm part of Kent Wildlife Trust. I'm also part of. And then I have memberships to my local wildlife conservation parks like the Aspinal foundation who are in Portland Zoo and Howlettz Wildlife park. They are a key breeding partner for endangered species and they also release them into the wild.
Tom: Your main place is to go shooting animals photography? I mean, it's in your backyard, in your town, or you go also out to zoos or wildlife places?
Jen: Ah, I normally go to one of the wildlife parks with my friends every Saturday. We try to as best as we can and sometimes during the week if I have a free day. But usually I'm in either hive canal, which is about a 20 minutes bus journey from my town, or I'm in Kirsney Abbey, which is Dover, the other side of my town.
Jen: If I'm not outside then yeah, I'm in focusing, catching up on the local parks and the beach.
Tom: And what's your favorite animal, Jen?
Jen: My favourite animal as a whole will always be a wolf. I'm, not particularly picky on the species of wolf, but wolves in general. My favorite animal that I've personally photographed so far, would be my kingfisher.
Tom: What I find amazing is that you show people that, because most people will say that you have to go to nature to make the pictures, but sometimes it's impossible to go or we don't have these animals.
Tom: So you have to go to a wildlife place where you go and you make incredible pictures there and you show the people that even you can go there, you can watch them there and you can make good photography. I like it very much, Jen, this aspect.
Jen: Thank you. it can be quite a challenge at the zoo to get a photo of the animals that don't look like they're in a zoo. Credit to the designers of their enclosures really, I have to say for that.
Jen: But, yes, definitely possible. But it adds that extra challenge to it. So it's good to see an animal in their natural environment, even though it's kind of not their natural environment, if that makes sense.
Tom: Yeah, no, I understand.
Tom: What equipment are you using now, Jen?
Jen: I currently have a Nikon Z6. And my Sigma 150 to 600 mm rarely ever leaves my camera. But I also have the Nikon 70 to 200, 2.8.
Tom: And you ever bought something that you say I, wish I haven't bought it?
Jen: And I'd like to say my tripod. Because I have a really love hate relationship with it. But, yeah, flash gun and tripod, I Wish I didn't invest in because I work outside a lot and the tripod is solely because of, ah, my one arm. I have too much freedom, just holding a camera. But when you add a tripod to. It, it's like 6ft of weight.
Dave: Jen, question for you.
Dave: I was thinking about our last conversation when we were getting to know each other. And then again, in this one, you try to capture in your pet photography, you try to capture the pet's personality. How do you do that? Do you go to visit them and get familiar with them like a day before the actual shoot? Or how do you work to bring out their personality and capture it?
Jen: First things I, do is every single potential client I have has to fill out a questionnaire.
Jen: And that questionnaire, gives me the basic information of their animal. So obviously what animal it is, what gender? Depending on the gender. Are they new or spayed solely if we're in a busy area or not. So I know to keep an eye out. If they're in season, they are not being photographed until after. And then I have more in depth questions, like, if they have any disabilities.
Jen: If they've got a hip dysplasia, theyre three legged, et cetera, blind, deaf. And then there's a little section at the bottom where I find out what their fun words are, where they love to be, what part of the day do they think that is the best? Which one of the family members do they love the most?
Jen: Although you'd love to think that dogs love everyone, there's always one individual person isn't there, that they love more? And then going by that questionnaire, then, yeah, if they are very nervous around new people, then, I will actively meet them beforehand so they're comfortable with me.
Jen: And then I never ask anything of any pets until at the end of our session, because then they're fully comfortable. They're tired because they've sniffed leaves and stuff. And then everything ends in lots of treats, toys, all the good stuff that you could ask for, or nothing at all, if that's the type of personality.
Dave: That's amazing. You've really got this figured out. Do you do pet portraits with the owner in the shot?
Jen: Yes, they ask me for it.
Dave: Does that make..it's hard enough doing good portrait photography of a single person standing there or posing. What's it like? It's like shooting two portraits at one time.
Jen: Yeah. It can be quite challenging because now I have to take into consideration the wind with their hair, especially if long hair, make sure they don't blink. Sometimes, though, I have people that really do not want a portrait with their dogs, so what I do instead is I get a close up of their dog's eye with their reflection in their dog's eye.
Dave: Oh, great solution.
Jen: Yeah. That is a lovely touch.
Dave: It's fascinating. I never would have thought there was so much to do it.
Dave: You think of pets and they're around, you play with them, they play with. You, you feed them, they snuggle up and fall asleep on you. End of story. But you've really got this figured out extremely well.
Jen: It's all about catching, the moments of love when you add a person into the picture with their dog, because anyone can sit, and I do love those photos as well. But that moment where they turn around and smile at them, and then the dog's looking at them with the utmost devotion, those moments come naturally, and you've just got to be there, ready and waiting.
Dave: Boy, that leads to a wonderful question.
Dave: Could you share with our listeners two or maybe three of the most memorable personal moments you've experienced in, shooting pets. And as a disabled photographer.
Jen: I photographed a pet cemetery once, so that was an extremely emotional and rememberable experience. So, of course, they're not obviously alive. At this point, but to be in such a sacred area was definitely one of the top ones up there.
Jen: Another rememberable experience. My friend's staffy, bless his heart, had to be put to sleep. His name was Blue. And for the week before we were going to have our session, he wasn't looking too good. And we had doubts, obviously, that it would happen. And I managed to push it forward a few days.
Jen: And the day that we went out, to do our session, he had this wonderful burst of energy, which I don't know if you're aware of this, but some dogs get very excitable just before they pass. I don't know the scientific name for it, but it is like a random burst of energy. But he had the time of his life. And to see an old dog who had been waddling and very upset the last few days just come to life in this last hour and a half before we went to the vet. I still kind of get teary over it now because it's been two years.
Jen: And to make that session even more magical, we're both massive fans of Marvel. So I edited his silhouette shot with his owner, with the dispersion edit. You know, when Thanos clicks his fingers and everything fades off.
Jen: That's the image edit that I did for it. And it came together so perfectly because he did fade off, across the bridge.
Dave: Well, your client must have just been thrilled with that result.
Jen: They cried and then I cried. And it's happy tears, but I was like, I don't want you crying, but you're making me upset.
Tom: Jen, if you can, send me the pictures and we will put one of them in the episode cover interview.
Dave: Oh, great idea. That would be wonderful. Jen, same question, but different subject.
Dave: What's one of your most memorable personal moments as a disabled photographer?
Jen: I would say, actually, it, was kind of an iffy situation, if you will.
Jen: But I was in Hive canal one time, and I was photographing dragonflies that was on the pond. And this guy came up to me, and he was very snotty. That's the only way I can really describe it. He took one look at my fin and one look at my camera, and at the time, I had a D5300. And, yeah, at first, he's very rude, honestly, one of the most rudest people I've ever met, actually.
Jen: And then once he saw my portfolio, I've never seen a guy change so quick. And, that really hit home for me. I don't know why specifically this reason, because I'm normally pretty bomb proof with my disabilities. But, yeah, this one really had me. So not entirely a great memory, but one that's definitely helped me push forward to where I am now.
Dave: There's an old saying that really just came to mind perfectly with what you described. It's from the US Navy Seals, and they just do incredible things all the time. But the saying is, you can give up, give in, or give it all you've got.
Jen: Yep. You've got to give it all you got.
Dave: That one is give it all you got is what you're describing. That is excellent. Jen.
Tom: Jen, I think the BBC...You have been with the BBC? Last week or so?
Jen: Oh, yes, last Friday. Maybe the Friday before. Yeah, within two weeks. Yeah. I got shown on the BBC News. On, both the radio, social media and on the national tv. So I'm not going to lie I've been hiding since then and waiting for it to blow over.
Tom: But it came out already?
Jen: Yes, it has.
Jen: It was shown Friday, the 20 something. The tv at 6.30, which is prime time for tv. I don't understand how I managed to get such big.
Jen: I don't know what you call it. Achievement, if you will. Yeah, it hasn't settled in yet in my head, so. Sorry if I'm rambling.
Dave: Yeah. You're looking at your television screen going, who's that person? That looks like me. Yeah, that looks like my camera.
Jen: Yeah, everything. He even got my, little key ring on the side of my camera, which is a lovely touch. It's a little dog bone, but, yeah, I love it so much. But not many people pick that out. And he spotted it straight. I was, ah, well, I am an animal photographer, so of course I've got to have it.
Dave: Amazing. Jen, there's one last question that I'd like to ask you. Just to kind of, pull things together for today's episode. For those people who are disabled but want to get into photography from your experiences, what is one thing you'd recommend they should start doing?
Dave: One thing they should stop doing and why?
Jen: Firstly, you start by starting it's okay to, fail. It's okay to mess up and unfortunately you are going to miss those awesome shots. And it sucks, but it happens. But keep going. I can't remember the name of the man who said the most legendary quote that your 1st 10,000 photographs are your worst. And, that is very true, other than the golden tickets every so often.
Jen: And the thing I would recommend you don't do is do not hang around with people that do not respect you enough. And I say that lightly because obviously everyone has a different relationship with everyone.
Jen: But if they're not pushing you forward and inspiring you, then do not be around them because you don't want the negativity. Life is hard as a disabled person as it is, and life is hard enough as an artist. Now, you put them two together.
Jen: With a bad support system and you won't get very far. And it's heartbreaking because you do have to leave some people behind. But as I said in the beginning. Mindset is everything and you need to be surrounding yourself with people who understand.
Dave: You just raised an excellent point.
Dave: You talked about support system. How important is your support system and what makes it up?
Jen: Goodness me, I have the most fantastic friends. I'm emotional because I love them all so much, but I had a very bad year last year and they completely saved me in so many ways. I don't know if I'm allowed to say their names, but I'll say their first names but my friend Kate, Jason, Chris, Kevin, Anne, and my other disabled friend Natasha, who I love dearly, I, would not be in the position I was today if I did not have them every day in a group chat cheering us all on, all helping each other.
Jen: And they're also the type of people that will tell you, no, you've missed something that's very bad. So it's a balanced criticism. You get all the good stuff and you also get the learning negative, which is better than just obviously negative, as we said earlier. But, yeah, but I can't fault my support system. So get yourself one and love them because they will do you great things.
Dave: So your support system, those people that are behind you, helping you, motivating you, challenging you to do better, that support system is as important as your camera gear?
Jen: They are way more important than my camera gear. I would happily go out of them any day of the week without any devices. And I don't know how many people can say that, that they can tolerate human beings without technology now. But, yeah, these guys are really next level and I say I can't thank them enough.
Dave: Well, that's excellent advice for disabled photographers and for people who want to get into the system.
Dave: I've had, folks, it's interesting, one of your stories just triggered a memory real quick.
Dave: I use a four wheel walker so that I can hold myself upright and move around. Then I'll sit down in the seat and shoot. And I had another photographer at a rose garden here who was just. The look on their face was, disdain is probably too polite a word for it. Like, what are you doing here? You're taking up space.
Dave: You've seen that, no doubt. And I smiled at him in my pathetic japanese, which is only a little bit. I told him, I said, chotamate. Wait a second. And I whipped out my phone and I showed him some portfolio shots that I'd prepared in the phone just for roses and bees. It was macro. And he looked at it and the expression, not only on his face, but the expression of his personality just completely changed.
Jen: Yeah, I could imagine.
Jen: So I bet he ate his own words when he got home.
Dave: It's amazing.
Jen: You never judge a book by it's cover.
Dave: Yeah. The support system is important from your friends, but you've also got to be strong enough to deal with those who don't understand your physical limitations or maybe are not respectful of them and just stay neutral and maybe show them your work.
Jen: That is the best thing you can do. Stay neutral, like you say.
Dave: Yeah, change people's thinking one mind at a time.
Jen: One at a time.
Dave: Yeah, it really does make a difference. And I've run into that photographer at that same location about two weeks later, and he walked up to me with a big smile and said, hello, and we ended up shooting next to each other for maybe 20 or 30 minutes. It was really special.
Jen: Oh, amazing. I'm glad to hear that.
Jen: Thankfully, haven't met my dude from hive Canal again.
Dave: Well, it sounds like you've done some tremendous, tremendous stuff, Jen, and I, love your photography. I'm going to have to look up your BBC show. I'm going on the Internet when we get off.
Tom: Jen, send me the link if you can.
Jen: I'll send you the link.
Dave: Oh, excellent. Thank you.
Dave: That's a good idea.
Dave: Yeah. Can we put that in the show notes, Tom?
Tom: Yeah, we can put it inside, of course.
Dave: Oh, that'd be wonderful. Then our guests can see you as well as hear you on our show.
Tom: That's great, Jen, I was wondering, you ever give talks in schools, or in groups about photography?
Jen: I haven't done anything for, about a year and a half because I was ill last year. But yeah, I have done it before and I'm always happy to answer any questions. So if anyone wants to message me, feel free because I do love a chat.
Tom: Okay, good. We still have to talk about the tattoo.
Tom: When are you going to put the logo from the podcast?
Jen: Have you got the forms? I don't want any copyright issues.
Tom: I think Dave and I will sign it.
Dave: No problem.
Jen: Okay, absolutely. You're going to have to choose a tattoo artist though, that you think will do your logo the best.
Tom: I think so. We will discuss it.
Jen: Okay.
Dave: I might have to go out and get our show tattoo logo too. I mean, why not?
Jen: You might as well. You love photography and, you got your little headphones to rock it with as well.
Dave: Little free advertising. That works well.
Jen: That would be amazing.
Dave: Great idea, Jen.
Dave: This has really been an enjoyable conversation and a great learning experience. Is there anything else you'd like to add about your photography, your approach to life? To our listeners?
Jen: As a very broad subject, I say. Just laugh a lot, I guess is probably the best more advice I can give you.
Jen: Find some good humor, watch a good tv show. Just make sure you relax because it's very easy to get into impostor syndrome, even when starting as a professional, anywhere in any career, really.
Jen: So make sure you look after yourself as much as you physically and mentally.
Dave: Wow. Great advice. Great advice.
Dave: Well, we'd like to thank Jen Reed for her time today, her inspiring journey, and her wonderful insights that she shared with us. Jen, hope to hear more. I'm looking forward to seeing your BBC interview, so thank you again.
Jen: I hope you guys have a wonderful day.
Tom: Thanks for talking Jen. Bye!
Tom: Wow, Dave, I love how joyful she sounds in our interview. I think it's amazing how people can be so strong to change their way of living in spite challenges that life has thrown against them in a way.
Tom: And I love her positive stories. To hear people like Jen explaining, full of passion, how they just thought one day, come on, I can do this. Let's give photography a go. And she has some amazing pictures and I'm sure we will hear a lot more about her in all these years to come.
Dave: I think your word joyful pretty well sums it up. Energy is just phenomenal and there's a drive you sense when you're listening to her and talking with her that there's nothing that's going to stop her and her photography.
Dave: Like you say, anyone who looks at her portfolio, you're going to be touched. I mean, she adds the special sauce so to speak, that I think only she can do like that. She's an inspiration. I mean, she makes me think about how I approach things, and I can do better. She's the way to do it.
Dave: Well, listeners will leave you with a quote from the renowned disabled indonesian professional photographer Ahmad Zulkarnian, born without hands or legs, who said, I don't let my limitations limit my steps forward or limit my dreams.
Dave: Thank you so much for listening today. Now pick up your camera, get out there and follow your dreams.